MLB player protests war by sitting out anthem

Gordon Gekko · Post by **Gordon Gekko** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 5:00 am

MIAMI (AP) -- Carlos Delgado is willing to stand up for his beliefs -- or, in his case, not stand up.

At his introductory news conference Thursday with the Florida Marlins, Delgado said he'll continue to not stand up this season during the playing of God Bless America.

An opponent of the war in Iraq, Delgado refused to stand when God Bless America was played last season at games involving his Toronto Blue Jays. Instead, he would stay on the bench or go into the dugout tunnel.

Opponent of the War in Iraq

King of Queens · Post by **King of Queens** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 5:19 am

This MIGHT belong on a differently-themed message board. That said, I am also against the whole "God Bless America" thing. It's not so much the song, but the speech that precedes it. At Yankee Stadium (and probably everywhere else except possibly Toronto), the song is preceded by a specch that basically says "Please stand and show your support for our troops who are protecting our freedom and way of life." I support the troops 100%, but how exactly are they protecting our freedom and way of life?

As the Eminem song goes, put a gun or two in Bush's daughters hands and send them to Iraq.

Balticsquids · Post by **Balticsquids** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 5:49 am

King, when u show up to your 2nd NFBC Draft , with your Laptop .That right there is because we have freedom...........the saying at the end of the song does not say"Support Bush and His War"

it does say Support our troops period .................know matter what wars past or present ,PAST being the key word

Walla Walla · Post by **Walla Walla** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 5:51 am

Should we hold up a baseball player making millions of dollars as a model of freedom?

Or should we hold up those that have died for that freedom? As we know there is nothing truly free. There has always been a price for freedom of speech, freedom to make money and freedom to vote. Those of us that have served in the military understand the price of that freedom. Do we like it that we have to fight for that freedom? No. But hard choices have to be made in life. You can respect the fact that others are paying the price for your freedom or you can try and make it a political debate. I choose to respect the brave fighting men and women who have chosen to put their lives in harms way. God bless America!!!

Balticsquids · Post by **Balticsquids** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 6:11 am

"How Exactly are they protecting our freedom and way of life" this quote is from a guy , who plays in such events and walks around with laptop.......I hope maybe u are just anti Bush , and i am misunderstanding u

Kevin D · Post by **Kevin D** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 6:39 am

Finally!!! Something I can agree with Walla Walla on.

I personally didn't stand for the THE NATIONAL ANTHEM!! for several years after returning from Vietnam. I was mad at what our goverment was doing and what it had put me through. BUT! I was more angry at the people who treated me like crap, called me names, and blamed the war and all the social upheaval on me.

They just didn't understand how trivial their daily existence is. Most still don't.

Today I tingle when I hear "The Anthem", overcome with gratitude for the fact I can express MY opinion, come and go as I please, join any group, eat ice cream, pick from an array of food and goods at several Supermarkets in town, play Fantasy Baseball, tend to my health, and deal with how the rest of the world feels about "Freedom American Style." The US Military, the most powerful in the known Universe, insures these things for me. God Bless the Troops.

As far as all the other stuff said and done daily about the state of the world, our place in it, and the myrid of problems Humankind faces, it's "Getting Better all the Ti--ime!" and the USA is a huge part of the improvement in making the world more secure, and healthy, while ensuring that the hope of freedom for all can become a reality.

In a thousand years we'll know. Our military is living and paying for that history right now.

King of Queens · Post by **King of Queens** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 6:39 am

Originally posted by Balticsquids:

and walks around with laptopI must have made quite an impression last year! I'll be sure to tone down my act in March.

Originally posted by Balticsquids:

I hope maybe u are just anti Bush , and i am misunderstanding u Not just anti-Bush. I would also consider myself anti-Cheaney, anti-Rumsfeld, anti-Rice, anti-Ashcroft, etc.

I believe there are times when the use of force (i.e. "war") is necessary. However, this war is a sham, and to tell the American people that are soldiers are there, right now, to protect our freedom and way of life is a complete and utter joke.

King of Queens · Post by **King of Queens** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 6:44 am

Just to set the record straight, I do respect the bravery that our soldiers have shown in combat. I would never personally attack members of our military, because these individuals have no choice in going to Iraq. They must do as they are told for the system to work.

One more thing: aren't you guys sickened by what's going on in Iraq? Dozens kidnapped, hundreds killed, thousands maimed. How are things "better"--either in our country or the world?

Kevin D · Post by **Kevin D** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 6:44 am

From "Kings and Queens"

I support the troops 100%, but how exactly are they protecting our freedom and way of life?

Kings,if you don't know, you're never GONNA know!

King of Queens · Post by **King of Queens** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 6:45 am

Originally posted by Kevin D:

As far as all the other stuff said and done daily about the state of the world, our place in it, and the myrid of problems Humankind faces, it's "Getting Better all the Ti--ime!" and the USA is a huge part of the improvement in making the world more secure, and healthy, while ensuring that the hope of freedom for all can become a reality.Someone needs a serious reality check.

King of Queens · Post by **King of Queens** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 6:49 am

Originally posted by Kevin D:

From "Kings and Queens"

I support the troops 100%, but how exactly are they protecting our freedom and way of life?

Kings,if you don't know, you're never GONNA know! I'm your huckleberry. Please try to explain.

I see a correlation of ZERO.

Kevin D · Post by **Kevin D** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 6:51 am

Kings and Queens again:

our freedom and way of life is a complete and utter joke.

The Joke is you're enjoying that way of life and don't realise it, how it came to be, and what it takes to keep it.

King of Queens · Post by **King of Queens** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 6:55 am

Originally posted by Kevin D:

Kings and Queens again:

our freedom and way of life is a complete and utter joke.

The Joke is you're enjoying that way of life and don't realise it, how it came to be, and what it takes to keep it. Thanks for misquoting me.

Stick to the basics: (1) Our troops are Iraq, getting picked off by the hundreds, even thousands. (2) We have a certain level of freedom (although rapidly decreasing, thanks to the Patriot Act) in America that allows us to do things that people in other countries cannot.

Please explain to me how (1) and (2) are at all correlated. Let's talk PRESENT TENSE.

Gordon Gekko · Post by **Gordon Gekko** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 6:58 am

Originally posted by Kevin D:

The Joke is you're enjoying that way of life and don't realise it, how it came to be, and what it takes to keep it. we could go for world domination and keep our current life style as is...do you advocate that sort of policy.

Gordon Gekko · Post by **Gordon Gekko** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 6:59 am

Originally posted by King of Queens:

Stick to the basics: (1) Our troops are Iraq, getting picked off by the hundreds, even thousands. (2) We have a certain level of freedom (although rapidly decreasing, thanks to the Patriot Act) in America that allows us to do things that people in other countries cannot.

don't forget (3) bush's friends make BIG $ off of the Iraq war

Walla Walla · Post by **Walla Walla** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 7:42 am

Gekko, This isn't fantasy talk. This is your Demo views. Please keep your views to yourself. Or post in the proper place.

Gordon Gekko · Post by **Gordon Gekko** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 8:00 am

Originally posted by Walla Walla:

Gekko, This isn't fantasy talk. This is your Demo views. Please keep your views to yourself. Or post in the proper place. The Forum is called Fantasy/MLB Talk. This thread is about a MLB player. easy enough

Leaderboard Sports · Post by **Leaderboard Sports** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 8:08 am

I'm a veteran, a patriot, and a conservative liberal of the greatest country on Earth. I expressed my displeasure with a war that I feel was unnecessary and a waste of human life by exercising my paid for in blood constitutional right to vote. Having been overruled by a majority of my fellow citizens I will abide by the duly elected government's policies whether I agree or not as that is the foundation of our government. While we all have the right of free speech and the freedom to disagree with our government, we also have an obligation to support that government once it's elected. We would be in constant Civil War if everytime those whose candidate didn't win an election refused to support the elected government.

Disrespect for the flag or anthem which symbolize our country is not in my opinion an acceptable form of free speech or protest. If Carlos Delgado is an American citizen he should be ashamed for not supporting the country which has allowed him to enjoy such an oppulent lifestyle. If he cannot support a constitutionally elected government he should not stay in this country. If he really wants people to know how strongly he opposes the war he should refuse to work, live, or accept money from this country. Then he would have my respect as a man willing to sacrifice for his beliefs. Millions have sacrificed far more to protect our system of government.

Trumpets blair and drums pound as Ken steps down from the podium and leaves the auditorium to a thunderous ovation and echos of "Mine eyes have seen the glory" rolling off in the distance :rolleyes:

King of Queens · Post by **King of Queens** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 8:19 am

Originally posted by Gordon Gekko:

quote:Originally posted by Walla Walla:

Gekko, This isn't fantasy talk. This is your Demo views. Please keep your views to yourself. Or post in the proper place. The Forum is called Fantasy/MLB Talk. This thread is about a MLB player. easy enough [/QUOTE]A baseball player AND something else.

At Yankee Stadium, they give the aforementioned hokey speech, then "God Bless America" is played, followed by...

"Cotton Eye Joe"

Gotta love the direction we're going in here.

King of Queens · Post by **King of Queens** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 8:22 am

Originally posted by Leaderboard Sports:

Disrespect for the flag or anthem which symbolize our country is not in my opinion an acceptable form of free speech or protest. If Carlos Delgado is an American citizen he should be ashamed for not supporting the country which has allowed him to enjoy such an oppulent lifestyle. If he cannot support a constitutionally elected government he should not stay in this country. He stands in the dugout. He doesn't burn an American flag or moon the crowd while the song is being played.

Maybe he should have stayed in Toronto, where at least he didn't have to put up with abuse for 1/2 the season.

Walla Walla · Post by **Walla Walla** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 8:23 am

Well you New york fans/players have proven one thing. There are ugly Americans.

Leaderboard Sports · Post by **Leaderboard Sports** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 8:42 am

Originally posted by King of Queens:

quote:Originally posted by Leaderboard Sports:

Disrespect for the flag or anthem which symbolize our country is not in my opinion an acceptable form of free speech or protest. If Carlos Delgado is an American citizen he should be ashamed for not supporting the country which has allowed him to enjoy such an oppulent lifestyle. If he cannot support a constitutionally elected government he should not stay in this country. He stands in the dugout. He doesn't burn an American flag or moon the crowd while the song is being played.

Maybe he should have stayed in Toronto, where at least he didn't have to put up with abuse for 1/2 the season. [/QUOTE]Well I said it was my "opinion". I feel that flag/song/anthem represent our country, not just the George W Bush part but the whole thing from 1776 till now. And in my "opinion" any form of protest against them whether it be sitting, burning, mooning, turning your back, or raising a black fisted glove, is anti-American. And this is coming from a liberal who is dead set against this stupid war and is counting the days till George leaves office.

RichV · Post by **RichV** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 9:10 am

Well said Leaderboard. It's not often I read, or hear anything from a liberal that I can even partially agree with. It's nice to know there are some liberals who don't sound anti-American every time they open their mouths.

Gordon Gekko · Post by **Gordon Gekko** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 9:29 am

Originally posted by Leaderboard Sports:

Having been overruled by a majority of my fellow citizens I will abide by the duly elected government's policies whether I agree or not as that is the foundation of our government. that's great. you do that. it's your right.

Originally posted by Leaderboard Sports:

we also have an obligation to support that government once it's elected. We would be in constant Civil War if everytime those whose candidate didn't win an election refused to support the elected government. i refuse to support garbage. simple, isn't it?

Walla Walla · Post by **Walla Walla** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 9:46 am

Gekko, Come to las Vegas. I'll explain it.