Not in favor at all of playing last week of baseball season

Gladiators · Post by **Gladiators** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:47 am

Too many guys sitting....I have lost 3 starts from some of my best pitchers (Weaver, Ervin Santana, Cain) on my 2 OC teams competing for both league title and top 10 overall. All 3 guys were scheduled to pitch as of yesterday morning. With the mass amounts of pitcher streaming going on these non starts are very damaging in some pitching categories. I wish baseball season ended similar to football with all the garbage going on in the last week.

I will play either way...but this is my $.02. It is tough for the standings to change so much in these last few days when there are a lot of regulars not playing or resting for postseason. I was in the top 10 overall for the past 4 months but have just now slipped out so obviously I needed those pitchers to start for me!

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:19 am

I have Weaver and Santana too. Sure, I'd like them to start, but I knew the risks before putting them in my lineup.

Some want more control by streaming pitchers. If anything, that made it temporarily out of control and did not help with the non starts of Weaver, Cain, Santana et al.

Without the streaming of pitchers during the last two weeks next year, it'll put everybody back on a more even platform.

It won't hurt as much missing starts because others aren't loading up on w's and k's.

Cutting off the last week or two of the season isn't the answer. Pitchers miss starts at Managers whims during the season too, it just hurts more when every stat becomes magnified during the end of the season.

If circumstances would have been different, Tim Hudson, John Lester, and Chris Carpenter owners would also be singing the blues. Its just the chances we take.

These owners also knew of the chances that their starter may be skipped.

Cutting off the season would be throwing the baby out with the bathwater (sorry, phrase from the old days).

Gladiators · Post by **Gladiators** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:34 am

So does your same theory apply to football? Because almost every major football contest ends in week 16 because of this same type of situation.

The streaming rule does not help this out- I agree with that. My point is all these 3 pitchers were scheduled to pitch as of roster deadline....yes I knew if the Angels were eliminated Weaver might not start. As for Cain....you could say the same for all the eliminated teams on whether or not they want to play their top level starters in their last start. It becomes a guessing game for fantasy managers then on who will start and who won't, because we all know MLB managers can switch lineups in things right up until game time.

This is exactly why football ends early, so fantasy managers do not have to guess as to which player will receive what playing time the final week.

As for Weaver/Cain owners...knowing the risks does not help at all actually. What would we do...SIT them? With roster sizes and the way streaming has been going, I doubt many managers would entertain the thought of sitting one of their top 3 starters the following week thinking they MIGHT not start.

Edwards Kings · Post by **Edwards Kings** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:35 am

I hear your pain, but I too am opposed to cutting out days/weeks in the end. Though my position in my leagues were pretty set coming into the stretch run, part of my "strategy" was to have enough FA money left to grab as many guys with the best chance of still playing as I could.

Cutting off time at the end of the season would not, in my opinion, make it better, only different.

ToddZ · Post by **ToddZ** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:57 am

Sorry, but the football analogy does not work for me. In weekly playoffs, week 17 would be for the whole kit and caboodle so i understand why football often elects to have their Fantasy Bowl on Week 16. In something like the NFFC where it is a sum of a few weeks, it is also understandable since it contributes a significant percentage of the totals.

But in baseball, what what are we talking about, losing 3 or 4 starts (maybe) out of 200-250 throughout the course of the season? Maybe losing 25-30 innings out of over 1500?

This is not to say that these lost games cannot be the difference, they certainly can. In fact, I guarantee that if either the AL or NL has a 163rd game, thousands of dollars will flip to another owner.

My point is in the big picture, the last 10 days are no more important than the first 10 days or 10 days at any other time, they are just magnified. Should we not count the time around the All-Star break as managers adjust their rotations and give players an extra day off if they are hurting a little to extend the recovery time?

I spend all winter trying to gauge a full season's worth of performance, I personally prefer to have the player's stats count for the entire season.

JMnotsoHO

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:04 am

Well said, Todd.

Throwing away the last two weeks of hitters and pitchers stats for the sake of a couple of missed starts just does not compute.

Hells Satans · Post by **Hells Satans** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:05 am

Upon reflection, I probably wouldn't want to end the season early either. The last two weeks of this contest have been such a cluster$%$#, I'm not really thinking straight.

Gladiators · Post by **Gladiators** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:37 am

Like I said....I will play either way. I do not understand at all how "spending the winter gauging a full season's worth of performance" has remotely anything to do with having top tier starters pulled within 24 hours of their final start the last couple days of season....but to each his own. I do understand how this week is not huge in the grand scheme of a roto contest, however everyone on here knows how things can fluctuate on a league/overall level on a nightly basis right up until the last pitch of the season. If you are saying that your team's position should already be secured going into the final week then either you haven't played roto for very long or else you are only fooling yourself. This isn't yahoo or sportsline leagues. This is high stakes, where most people on here are pretty competitive and knowledgeable.

Part of me wonders if Scoscia isn't trying to penalize the Tigers some after their Weaver brawl in Comerica this summer by laying down to Texas and allowing them to grab home field for the 1st round instead of Detroit. I know the Angels probably hate Texas a lot more then Detroit....I just don't understand not finishing the season strong against their rival unless they are concerned with Santana/Weaver's innings or something.

ToddZ · Post by **ToddZ** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:47 am

Originally posted by Gladiators:

I do not understand at all how "spending the winter gauging a full season's worth of performance" has remotely anything to do with having top tier starters pulled within 24 hours of their final start the last couple days of season....but to each his own. Because there are many, many more players that would have their season cut prematurely short by ending the fantasy season early than there are players shut down for the last week or so.

"Solving" one problem leads to another, which to me is more significant.

[ September 28, 2011, 09:52 AM: Message edited by: ToddZ ]

Hells Satans · Post by **Hells Satans** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:51 am

The surprising thing about the Weaver move is that he could win the ERA title very easily; I think a scoreless inning would do it. It wouldn't shock me if me he pitched an inning today.

Gladiators · Post by **Gladiators** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 4:02 am

Ok...but I disagree that the final week of baseball is at least comparable to football in a fantasy perspective. The guessing game is going to play a factor, and that is why major fantasy football contests have chosen to end the season short. Who would have known Cain was going to sit today simply because the Giants wanted to get one more look at Surkamp?

ToddZ · Post by **ToddZ** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 4:11 am

Comparable, but to a small degree as the impact of Surkamp/Cain in terms of the big picture (a season's worth of roto stats) is minute compared to Manning or Brady sitting for a half or the entire game when you have the opportunity to play your reserve QB instead.

That said, while I will stop short of suggesting the conspiracy theory, I am disappointed that the Angels sat Santana and Weaver during games that impact the race. I understand limiting innings, but I fail to see how 5 or 6 more leads to a greater injury risk in SIX MONTHS.

Gladiators · Post by **Gladiators** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 4:17 am

I do not get the Angels at all....I think Texas will crush them again tonight as the Angels are throwing out Richards to get shelled and probably sitting some regulars again if I guess correctly. Why would anyone even show up tonight to root for the Angels? What a way to go out....especially when Weaver would have at least been worth the price of admission with ERA on the line. This limit innings garbage is ridiculous in many player's cases.

Integrity of the game should be worth something when playoff opponents/homefield advantage are yet to be determined.

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 6:10 am

Brandon Phillips is sitting himself today to protect his .300 average.

Somewhere, Ted Williams is turning over in his cryogenic chamber.

Money · Post by **Money** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 6:19 am

Originally posted by Gladiators:

I do not get the Angels at all....I think Texas will crush them again tonight as the Angels are throwing out Richards to get shelled and probably sitting some regulars again if I guess correctly. Why would anyone even show up tonight to root for the Angels? What a way to go out....especially when Weaver would have at least been worth the price of admission with ERA on the line. This limit innings garbage is ridiculous in many player's cases.

Integrity of the game should be worth something when playoff opponents/homefield advantage are yet to be determined. What the Angels are doing is deplorable. Their playing patsy for a division foe. The same division foe that had a backdoor deal to get Mike Napoli away from them this year. Do you think the Angels would have traded Napoli to the Rangers? No way. Toronto gets him and turns him over to the rangers inside of 24 hours. The angels are almost as pathetic as the dodgers.

DOUGHBOYS · Post by **DOUGHBOYS** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 6:25 am

And Reyes goes out after a bunt single to maybe protect his batting championship.

What in the name of Ted Williams is going on?

Play it out!

MichiganFantasyTeam · Post by **MichiganFantasyTeam** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 6:48 am

I think the Angels just really hate Detroit right now...

Do You remember during the Angels/Tigers games year. There was so much tension and hate left out on the field.

There was almost 3 brawls during those games this year...

How about the Carlos Guillen homer off Weaver when he flipped his bat and Weaver went nuts.

The hard slides at 2nd for both teams.

I also think Weaver pitches at least 1 inning tonight, to get that ERA title.

People in Detroit are already pissed at what the Halos are doing...I can't imagine if Weaver does that on top of throwing a series.

MichiganFantasyTeam · Post by **MichiganFantasyTeam** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 6:55 am

Why are only pitchers coming up in this topic?

What about the position players that got hurt or shut down for the season on Sunday, Monday or Tuesday. People had Sizemore, Trumbo, Furcal, etc in their lineups.

I know plenty of teams will lose by 1 point in a hitting category too. What is the difference? You are only mad about their pitchers not starting?

Dub · Post by **Dub** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 7:22 am

Glad- I am playing against you in one of those OC leagues and I elected not to stream because I didn't want to take the whip risk.

Gladiators · Post by **Gladiators** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 8:18 am

Phillips and Reyes are a perfect example of why the last few days of season IMO should not be considered in overall stats.....you guys can say what you want but there are going to be A LOT of guys upset at several members of their team in this scoring period either taken out, shut down, etc. when they had no indication of it on Monday (when they set their lineups).

Yes, both pitching and hitting stats are affected. It just seems that when you lose some pitching starts it is more of a heavier blow. Especially when they are pitchers of Weaver, Cain stature. The way the Rockies have been hitting in SF this series, Cain could have easily went 8 IP, 0-1 ERs, with 6-8 Ks. That is enough to lose out on lots of points in 4 of the 5 pitching cats at the overall level.

Gladiators · Post by **Gladiators** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 8:20 am

Dub...I don't blame you. The way your pitching is going you don't have anywhere to go but down if you stream. Nice job on pitching.

JohnP · Post by **JohnP** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 9:25 am

Originally posted by DOUGHBOYS:

And Reyes goes out after a bunt single to maybe protect his batting championship.

What in the name of Ted Williams is going on?

Play it out! You won't see that in Milwaukee tonight! What a great scene / story that is. Will be another packed house tonight with everyone chewing their brats, chugging their Miller's, and waving their white hankies. Anyone catch Plesac and Reynolds last night on MLB Tonight? Love those guys! Plesac was in classic form last night.

TOXIC ASSETS · Post by **TOXIC ASSETS** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 12:12 pm

I remember well the end of the 2009 season. My first year playing with the "big boys" in the NFBC, in a satelite league. When the season ended I was in first by a point. BUT....stop the presses....there was a one game playoff between Detroit and Minnesota for game 163 of counting the stats. When the smoke cleared, it was a TIE for first and we split $1,400. I was glad to get the tie because I could have easily lost first entirely because my opponent had more players going in that playoff game than I did. Crazy times!

Dub · Post by **Dub** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 12:25 pm

Originally posted by Gladiators:

Dub...I don't blame you. The way your pitching is going you don't have anywhere to go but down if you stream. Nice job on pitching. HRs will decide it. Arod, Panda, Cabrera (saving his 300 ave) on the bench. I bid Craig and didnt use him and missed big yesterday. Went JD instead and hurt his ankle.

Good luck tonight. You me or Z&C Could finish 1st, 2nd or out of the money.

Dub · Post by **Dub** » Thu Sep 29, 2011 12:33 am

Originally posted by Dub:

quote:Originally posted by Gladiators:

Dub...I don't blame you. The way your pitching is going you don't have anywhere to go but down if you stream. Nice job on pitching. HRs will decide it. Arod, Panda, Cabrera (saving his 300 ave) on the bench. I bid Craig and didnt use him and missed big yesterday. Went JD instead and hurt his ankle.

Good luck tonight. You me or Z&C Could finish 1st, 2nd or out of the money. [/QUOTE]Wow- what an insane finish. James freakin Looney erased all my bad decisions over the year.